ok, thanks

edit: tried now, and you were right (not that i thought you werent but still...)

All the commanders are roughly similar but things vary depending on what configurations your comparing. If you notice each commander has 3 backpack sets...

Defensive (Shield, Armor, Pure Lambda)
Intel (Observation/Teleport, Cloak/Stealth)
Combat (Missile Barrage/Tac Nuke, Maelstrom Area Kill, Harrassment/Teleport, Overcharge Booster)

The system is designed for the comparisons to be made on those packs within those groupings. Comparing a fully shielded UEF ACU with a Stealth/Cloak Cybran ACU might result in similar top end HPs but in a straight fight the UEF comes out ahead because because the Active Regen on the shield is much higher.

Technically I think the power order within those categories tends to be:
Defensive : Seraphim > UEF > Cybran > Aeon
Intel : Cybran > Seraphim > UEF/Aeon
Combat : Aeon/UEF > Cybran > Seraphim

Keep in mind thats backpack slot only and doesn't take into account changes made by your primary weapon & engineering choices. Depending on the primary weapon you choose and the support system (RAS or Combat Engineering) those balances can shift alot. Especiailly when you consider some of the tactices they combos are designed for

Basically the goal was to keep things as balanced as possible while providing for any possible playstyle people want to use and still keep factional diversity & strengths/weaknesses apparent... And yes getting it to this state has been a pain in the butt

Extra notes:
- Lambda is THE BEST defensive option because it can negate the most weapon types. AoE weapons can sometimes still hit the ground close enough to splash the commander and high RoF weapons can help distract the emitters letting other shots through. Beam weapons, Torpedos & Overcharge shots do not degraded by the field and hit with full force.
- Active Shields are great at taking punishment because they are constantly regenerating. Due to a script interaction glitch (that I like) it also causes Beam Weapons to do about 1/3rd their normal damage when hitting the shield. Takes full damage from everything else and has to recharge if knocked out. Unfortunatly the unit under it usually doesn't have the armor regen to keep up with the damage that took out the shield.
- Hawks comment about UEF Gattling being the single highest DPS short of the masor depends on what your shooting. Long term fights the Seraphim version has it beat but only because the UEF one has a cooldown. If the thing dies fast enough it doesn't matter
- Final power levels are comparable to an experimental but like an experimental it depends on usage. With one combination you will be a single target anti-experimental monster (cybran are good at this, or Seraphim with boosted OC) while with a different combination you could cause mass destruction army wide (Aeon Maelstrom helps here but so does UEF Tac Nuke)

There will be some new things on the commanders? For example, version 4.0?

At this point, the ACUs are "Complete", any further updates would be for balance, bug-fixing and SCU changes.

Mike

This has got to be from one of the mods I installed right? I have the BlackOps, Mayhem and SupremeUnit mods installed. Which one is responsible for it and how do I counter those bouncing missiles from my UEF cruise ships? It's so weird.

BO:ACU Seraphim Lambda Field Upgrades
And it bounces more than missiles
Best bet would be to use Beams (as they pass through field), Rapid Fire style weaponry (which can overwhelm the field) or Bomber swarms. Sniping a Seraphim ACU is a little impossible unless your missile volley is rather rediculous to begin with

Either way the goal is to fire enough shots at it at the same time for some of them to get through

Thank you. Now, I need to find the thread which describes the units in BO. I hope it exists and not too hidden from easy search and view.

And I want to continue such a cool mode)))

And I have one question... why do we need these cheap and rapid improvement of combat arms? Well, I saw three sets of normal (torpedoes, machine gun / laser and EMP / artillery), and a fourth set of what? It is clearly weaker.

I just cant wait till SCUs get a variety of combat and defensive upgrades along the same sorta lines as the commanders...

Makes me imagine like UEF SCUs with anti air and ground capable shoulder energy lancer turrets and an arm mounted gattling plasma <3

@BARTON16: Basically its there for the tourney style rush players that where use to getting the normal ACU's default gun upgrades within the first 5 or so min of gameplay while fending of T1 bot spam. It was added back to the mod once this group of players realized (and threw a fit) that all of the normal Gun & Backpack upgrades where designed for the Tech 2+ era of the game since its best to build at least one engineering arm upgrade before you install a new gun.

The bonus provided by the default gun upgrade is permanent even if the dinky little enhancment is removed for a better gun. In fact for balance purposes it gets applied for free once you install the 2nd tier of any of the new guns. Its really only there for those who want a cheap very early game upgrade. Aeon is the only one to have a two tiered default gun upgrade and thats only because they had the same setup on the Default ACU, I didn't see any reason to not keep the factional difference.

I believe the ingame mouseover descriptions mentioned that

@4rchon: Right um maybe I should get around to digging that stuff out for hawk & Knight. Granted they have alot as it is I think

I would definitely love to see SCU enhancements in the future. Would it be possible to consider adding a new unit to the game, which would be an SCU, summoned the same way, but with just combat upgrades, and change the default SCU to an engineering upgradable unit? So unlike the ACU where its one unit, have two SCUs, one being combat oriented, and one being engineering oriented?

Then what would be the point of enhancements? ;p

The way that we(Exavier) planned the upgrades(if I recall them correctly) less about each only upgrading 1 thing, they're more like value packs, having more smaller changes that help direct how the SCU will be used.

Mike

Yea basically the work I have done on them so far is that I am going to treat SCU upgrades as kits rather than individual upgrades. Mainly so there isn't as much micromanagment to build multiple upgrades per SCU every game. Each SCU would come off the gate rather weak (a glorified engineer really) and then you can pick one of 6-8 kits to outfit the SCU for the role you want it to be used for.

Each kit would apply a dozen or so different changes to the SCU that you would normally have had to upgrade on at a time

Sounds good. I was envisioning the SCUs almost like mini-ACUs, with the same types of upgrades, and same amount of upgrades, but I do believe that kits would be a lot easier from a game play perspective.

Hey, is there any way for you guys to add support for Domino's 4DC mod? On the seraphim commander he has an extra enhancement slot for his phasing, but it seems that is only on the stock ACU, and the Black Ops ACU does not have it.

You would have to ask them to write a script to detect & hook their code into my ACU. They already have the code to do it if they want to because the Commander Hunker mod does it.

Basically my commanders are a custom unit (different unitID than normal ACUs) that gets swapped into place at spawn in. This was done to prevent a multitude of compatability errors with older ACU mods that rely on destructive hooking. Other mods that make changes to the ACUs have to be set up to specifically look for & hook the custom unit IDs if they choose to add any extra enhancments to my commanders. Otherwise the changes still get applied to the default (and not spawned) ACU.

Any chance of making this compatible with Gilbots modpack? I edited Gilbots modpack and the BO:ACU myself and got them working together. However, I had to remove enhancement queue from Gilbots modpack to get the commander enhancements to function correctly and in doing so, if you manually enhance the maximum amount of enhancements using Gilbots unit enhancements it crashes on the last one. The "upgrade all enhancements" button still works and I don't know why anyone would want to upgrade them all individually (time consuming micro), but it's still a bug I don't know how to fix.

Nope because the necessary changes are on Gilbot's side of things and he hasn't been around in a very long time. Was taking a break from coding when I last talked to him (shortly after v1 of BOGIS). And unfortunatly I won't edit & re-release another persons mod just to get compatability from their end.

Part of the problem is that Gilbot's enhancment scripts are pre BOGIS/DMS style of loading icons which means it doesn't play nice with anyone else (even mods that use the old way will get overwritten or will overwrite his scripts). Even if I was willing to rewrite someone elses work to fix the glitches I don't have the time

Hmm though I had his mod listed on the incompatabilities list... guess I will have to re-add it. Its a great modpack but such is the downside of mods. Without maintanence they eventually become obsolete or unusable.

That's very unfortunate, I would like to point out in my post above though. I did get it working fine with all BO mods, the only conflict was that they both replace the ACU, BO does it for upgrades, and Gilbots does it for the adjacency controller. All I did was add the adjacency controller code to the BO ACUs and it works fine. The only real problem is Gilbots enhancement queueing doesn't play nice with the new ACU upgrades in BO. I wish I knew the code to exclude the BO commanders from the enhancement queue code and everything would be great, currently i just disabled the enhancement queueing since it's not really needed anyway.

I would imagine it's something like (ClassType != EEL0001) maybe? maybe not?

Thanks anyway.

Exavier installed 3.2 and tested it twice.

UEF Back - T2-T3-T4 Shield Upgrades doesn't increase HP of the commander..Can you please verify it ?

You are correct and this is intended.
Active Regen shields used by the Aeon & UEF are very strong defenses but once the shield goes down your commander has to fall back on weaker armor & armor regen which is bad since the UEF & Aeon arn't as good at armor regen/repair as the Cybran or Seraphim lol. The total HP (Health+Shield) of a fully shielded ACU is similar to a fully Armored Cybran ACU.

Exavier then UEF shield upgrade explanations shouldn't include HP upgrades. All of them has this written.

What do you mean the explanations shouldn't include HP upgrades?
If your referring to the descriptions number texts they specifically say "+### Shield Health"... How is that being misunderstood as being normal Health?

just wanted to thank you guys for all the work you put into these mods, these improved acu's have made the game (and the campaign) that much more fun, i especially like the uef cluster missile launcher, such a powerfull weapon at the early tiers