Hi all

Just in trying to be brief. I've outlined here the idea of what would be my dream game. I haven't bothered with purchasing Supcom2 and fell off the bandwagon when FA went out of fashion. I'd like to know if supcom2 was everything that people thought it would be, and what changes they would have liked? Is FA still in use and what changes would you like to see? What thoughts do you have on the gameplay as outlined below?

I'm sorry if this is a bit hard to understand, but the ideas I have in my head on how the game should work are fairly complex.


1.Weaponry Types

Interceptor -> ([KILLS]Missiles, Air) Direct fire missile interceptor, also functions as base level AA. The weapon class includes direct fire projectiles and air-burst explosive shells. (AA, Flak & TMD have been combined into one weapon type).
Missile/Rocket -> ([KILLS]Heavy Land, Surface) Area bombardment, mainly effective against heavy land targets and structures
Guided Missile -> ([KILLS]Heavy Land, Surface) High damage tracking projectile, small land not targetable.
Surface-to-Air Missile (SAM) -> ([KILLS]Air) Tracking projectile
Air-to-Air Missile -> ([KILLS]Air) Tracking projectile, can only be fired when behind most targets, (gunships can be hit from any angle).
Flamer -> ([KILLS]Land) Short ranged high yield area damage, equaly effective vs small and large targets. This weapon class can include flame, irradiation and other area dispersed weapon types.
Light Cannon -> ([KILLS]Air, Land) Basic direct fire weapon, better turrent physics, but largely ineffective vs heavy targets. Predominantly featuring projectile weapons in burst fire mode.
Heavy Cannon -> ([KILLS]Heavy Land, Surface, Strategic Aircraft) High yield direct fire weapon, small land not targetable. Slower turrent physics and lower accuracy. Can include continuous beam, pulse beam, explosive projectile, burst fire and disruptor weapon types.
Artillery -> ([KILLS]Land, Surface) Howizer artillery shells, with splitting warheads that pepper a large area with many exploding ordinance. Designed to be effective against large clusters of entrenched small land units. but has only limited effectiveness against heavy land units. Minimum range requirement.
Naval Artillery -> ([KILLS]Land, Surface) A modified artillery consisting of either an armour piercing round, or a combination of armour piercing and multi-projectile explosive ordinance fired in a single volley. The primary ordinance carried by battleships. More effective against large units and structures.
Torpeedo -> ([KILLS]Heavy Sea) Close range high yield tracking projectile. Deals a devastating ammount of damage but must be fired from a submarine at close range. Escort boats are not targetable. There are no torpeedo countermeasures.
Rocket Torpeedo -> ([KILLS]Heavy Sea) Two stage high yield tracking projectile, allowing torpeedo attack from long range. A highly lethal weapon carried by specialised attack vessels, the projectile can be targeted by missile interceptors only in the rocket stage. Escort boats are not targetable.
Depth Charge (DC) -> ([KILLS]Submersible) Close range explosive, the primary ordinance carried by escort boats and ASW Drones.
Rocket Propelled Depth Charge (RPDC) -> ([KILLS]Submersible) Two stage explosive, can be targeted by missile interceptors only in the rocket phase. Ordinance typically carried by Frigates and Destroyers.
Bomb - ([KILLS]Land, Surface) Area bombardment
Naval Mine - ([KILLS]Naval Surface) Ambush explosive
Land Mine - ([KILLS]Heavy Land) Ambush explosive, light BOTs are unaffected
Strategic Missile "Nuke" - ([KILLS]Sea, Air, Land) Massive Explosive
SMD - ([KILLS]Nuke) Strategic Missile Countermeasure
"Slicer" or "Hacker" - ([CAPTURES]Structures, Static Emplacements, Mobile Emplacements) Captures enemy to gain control, direct combat units not vunerable.


2.Structure Types

Earthworks
1. Dugout/Trench System
A trench line can be constructed by stringing straight trench lines between 2 or more dugouts. A ramp must be defined for the end dugout. Trenches can be crossed by light bots, but impeede the progress of heavy land units. Mobile/static emplacements can be positioned in dugouts. Light bots and static emplacements can be afforded some protection from direct fire when positioned in a trench. A trench can be constructed behind an existing wall line for increased protection.

2. Wall System
A wall construct is the fastest and most cost effective defensive construct. A wall-node provides a circular wall barrier to protect a single mobile/static emplacement from direct fire. A wall line can be constructed by joining 2 or more wall-nodes. Walls can impede the path of small bots, but not larger tanks which can simply plow straight through them. A wall system can added to a trench line or gantry, to give increased protection.

3. Raised Pad/Gantry System
The ultimate defensive construct, raised pads can be built to give static emplacements an elevated firing position. Gantry walls can be constructed by joining 2 or more raised pads with stright line gantry segments. A ramp must be defined at the end pad. Gantries are an obstacle to both bots and tanks, and are wide enough for units to be placed upon them. A wall system can be built upon a gantry for additional protection. Gantries are only vunerable to sustained bombardment by heavy weapons. The only land unit that can pass a gantry is an Assault Mech equiped with jump-jets.


Mobile Emplacement
[Defensive Installations that can be repositioned, they sacrifice armour for mobility. However, they are completely vunerable when mobilised and only work when deployed]

Missile Interceptor - A portable missile defence, and stop-gap AA unit, only fires when deployed (This is the only form of mobile AA)
Missile Launcher - Fires volleys of rocket artillery, only fires when deployed
Mobile Howizer - A portable field artillery unit, only fires when deployed
Mobile Shield - A portable shield generator, it has a power demand and only works when deployed
Field Scanner - A portable radar unit, it has a power demand and only works when deployed
Field Engineering Unit - A portable unit, when deployed allows the construction of structures within a radius of the unit. Repairs units in this radius when not engaged in construction, but requires power to operate.
Mobile Power Generator - A portable generator, when deployed it connects into the local power grid and allows powered devices within a certain radius to operate. Provided that the local grid has sufficient power to meet the demand. (Equivalent T1)


Static Emplacement
[Defensive installations that are built in place and cannot be moved]

Heavy Turrent - A heavy direct fire weapon desinged to destroy heavy land units, requires power to operate
Missile Interceptor - a static missile defence, and stop-gap AA unit, (no power required).
SAM Launcher - High end AA protection, fires surface-to-air missiles, requires power to operate
TML - Fires long range guided cruise missiles, requires power to operate
Artillery Turrent - A heavy artillery weapon, minimum range requirement, requires power to operate.
Bunker - This structure provides light cannon defensive fire, however its primary purpose is to manufacture light bots. This structure will automatically replace lost units from infantry squads within a certain radius. It requires power to operate, but will fire when unpowered.
Drone Tower - Maintains and deploys a squadron of aerial combat drones for local air defence, drones can also be upgraded with a particular weapon specialisation. Requires power to operate, but drones will deploy unpowered.


Structures
[Primary Base Structures, built in place]

Mass Extractor - Generates mass, requires power to operate
Engineering Station - A permanent structure that allows the construction of structures within a certain radius. It can also manufacture mobile emplacements but requires power to operate.
Power Generator - A static power generator designed to meet heavier power requirements. (Equivalent T2)
Heavy Power Generator - A static power generator designed to meet massive power requirements. (Equivalent T3)
Consealed Power Distribution Node (CPDN) - A consealed structure that allows the underground extension of an existing power grid in exposed locations, however the CPDN by itself does not generate power.
Radar - A static radar unit, detects non-stealthed units within the area, requires power to operate
SATCOM Unit - A static communications tower, it allows realtime tactical data to be communicated between allies (ie.allows shared line-of-sight). It also has a sattelite scanning function, to detect fixed enemy structures over the entire map area (with a time delay based on a scanning pattern).This structure requires power to operate.
Shield Generator - A static shield generator, requires power to operate
Stealth Field Generator - A static stealth generator, requires power to operate
Land Factory - Constructs and repairs heavy land units, including Tanks, Assault Mechs and Capital Tanks, requires power to operate
Airstrip - Constructs and repairs and houses several wings of tactical fighters/gunships. It requires power to operate
Airfield - An upscaled version of an airstrip. It constructs repairs and houses many wings of tactical fighters/gunships, in addition to housing multiple capital/strategic aircraft. It maintains a squadron of aerial combat drones for self defence, and requires power to operate
Shipyard - Constructs and repairs naval vessels, connection to a local power grid is not required, but it does require power to operate.




3.Economic Notes

Power
Power is based on local power grids, not the total net position of power generation, as in SC/FA.
When a structure is within the radius of a power generator it is connected to that generator
When two power generators are within radius of each other, they become linked to form a local power grid
A structure will be powered when 1. it is connected to a grid and 2. that grid has sufficient power avaliable to supply it. On this basis a structure with large demand can be supplied by a small generator, if it is connected to additional generators. Power distribution nodes can also be constructed for this purpose, particulary when supplying defensive lines.
Due to the new difficulties inctroduced, generators should have greater capacity, so that they are not needed in large numbers, but rather are needed in strategic locations.

Mass
Little change from SC/FA is proposed, except perhaps that the mex upgrade system be automated, or removed altogether.
An alternative to be considered is unrestricted mexes, with an open area based system (refer to BFME2). Tactical regions could be created by making "hot spots", areas of high mass yield (ie. highLocalResourceFactor). Thus MassIncome=NetArea*LocalResourceFactor.

Engineers
I'd propose that construction engineers be removed from the game and replaced with the Engineering Station (ES) and Field Engineering Unit (FEU). These a static structure, and it's mobile variant. When deployed, these structures allow any building to be built within a certain radius. Thus the BO is no longer unit specific and will be completed by any ES or FEU within range. The build palete can be brought up by right-mouse-click on any open terrain, or by using a building pallete docked in the UI. Structures outside of ES range will simply be qued, and will wait until an FEU is deployed or ES constructed.


4.Small/Escort Units

In the Air, Sea and Land categories, there is a small unit class designed to function in an escort capacity. While not able to deal significant damage the loss of an escort group will render the larger and heavier units vunerable. This encourages the use of balanced force composition, and allows strategic depth and the ability to exploit this dynamic for advantage.

Light BOT -
This unit is a small land unit, not targetable by some larger weapons. They are constructed and controled as squads. Light BOTs are constructed by bunkers and also by the largest tanks. They tend to function as autonomous squds but can also be attached to larger units for use as escorts.

Commando BOT -
This is a small land unit not targetable by some larger weapons. They are deployed via parachute using strategic bombers, as an optional bomber upgrade option. The Commando BOT has less armour then their standard counterparts, but have a more damaging shorter ranged weapon. They can attach demolition changes to structures and are equiped with an Active Camoflauge System (ACS) allowing them to move undetected.

Aerial Combat (AC) Drone -
This unit is a small intercept fighter. Squadrons of AC Drones are attached to a carrier unit which will repair, reload and replace lost units. AC Drones are automatically deployed to meet incoming aircraft. AC Drones can be housed in Drone Towers, Airfields, Aircraft Carriers and Strategic Aircraft.

Anti-Submarine Warfare (ASW) Drone -
This is a slower VTOL aircraft carried on Frigate and Aircraft Carrier class vessels. Equiped with depthcharge and the ability to spot submarines and naval mines from overhead. This craft will scout the water ahead of a ship when underway, and automatically deploy to kill any detected submarine in the area.

Escort Boats -
A flotilla of escort boats will be maintained by Capital ships but can also be constructed as an autonomous group. They come equiped with DC, and are not targetable by torpeedos. They can also be equiped with AA and Interceptor armament for use as an aerial picket line vessel, or alternatively as a minehunter vessel for disposing of naval mines.


5.Unit Class & General Counters

Light BOT >> Tank, Mega Tank
Tank >> AM, Structures
Assault Mech (AM) >> Light BOT
Mega Tank >> AM, Tank, Structures



Escort Boat (EB) >> SS, Mines
Attack Submarine (SS) >> CL, CV, BB
Guided Missile Submarine (SSG) >> EB, FF, Structures
Frigate (FF) >> SS, EB
Destroyer (DD) >> SS, FF, EB, CL, Air
Cruiser (CL) >> BB, CV, Air, Structures
Battleship (BB) >> Structures
Carrier (CV) >>

AC Drone >> ASB, Gunship, SF, ASW Drone
ASW Drone >> SS, SSG
Air Support Bomber (ASB) >> Light Bots, Tanks
Gunship >> Light Bots, AM
Strike Fighter (SF) >> Gunship, Strategic Bomber, Mega Tanks, Structures
Air Superiority Fighter (ASF) >> AC Drone, ASW Drone, ASB, Gunship, SF
Strategic Bomber >> Land, Structures


6.Unit Upgrade Notes

Unit upgrades may be avaliable to most unit types, and allow for different mission profiles. This allows some simplicity in game design, as the same unit model can be re-used to represent many unit variations, with visual distinction made by adding visible external attachments (bones) to the unit. The player will feel more at ease, in the knowledge that specialist units are not a wasted investment and can be re-equiped to face changing threats.

The upgrade system should be applied as follows:
Upgrades will generally consist of an additional armament, ability or enhancement, however upgrades should also be mutually exclusive. The unit can only carry 1 (or 2) enhancements at any one time. Enhancements cost resources and time to install. They are not purchased at a reasearch station and do not apply to the entire army, they are applied to individual units. Enhancements can only be installed from within range of an engineering station, in the case of heavy land units, but light BOTs can be equipped when near a bunker. Air units can only be upgraded when housed in a carrier, or when grounded at an airfield. Naval vessels can only be equipped when near a shipyard. Units will be immobilised for the duration of the upgrade. Small/Escort unit upgrades will apply across the entire squad/squadron/flotilla, replacement units will be automatically upgraded to the squads current specs. Some units may have 2 upgrade slots allowing them to carry 2 upgrades at the same time. when an upgrade is removed a certain percentage of the cost can be refunded.

Some ideas for units and corresponding upgrades are as follows:

Light BOTs - TotalUpgradeSlots=2
1. Flamer - Equips half of the BOTs with a short range flamethrower for destroying tanks and other BOTs.
2. Rocket - Equips half of the BOTs with a Rocket launcher for destroying tanks and assault mechs
3. Sniper - Equips half of the BOTs with a modification to the existing weapon
4. Engineer - Allows the squad to clear landmines and also allows the squad to capture enemy buildings
5. ACS - Equips the entire squad with active camoflauge system (ACS), allowing them to move undetected.

Tank - TotalUpgradeSlots=1
1. Shield - gives the tank a small shield generator
2. Dozer - Allows the tank to demolish trenches
3. Flamer - gives the tank an additional close range defence weapon

Assault Mech - TotalUpgradeSlots=1
1. Jump Jets - Allows short range point to point flight mobility
2. Rocket battery - Allows the assault mech to fire a volley of rockets for longer ranged harrasment, must be static to fire.
3. Heavy Cannon - Adds a heavier cannon to complement the existing light machine gun, allowing the assault mech to destroy heavier targets.

Massive/Capital Tank - TotalUpgradeSlots=2
1. Artillery - Provides an additional heavy artillery turrent, must deploy to fire
2. Shield - gives the tank a medium sized shield generator
3. AA - Equips the tank with missile interceptors and SAM launchers
4. Armour - provides additional armored exoskeleton to the tank
5. Engineering - provides the unit with an onboard powered engineering bay, allowing it to build structures when deployed.


* note for air units - bombs, missiles & cargo can only be reloaded at airfield/carrier/drone tower.

AC Drone - TotalUpgradeSlots=1
1. Bomb - Equips the drone squadron with 2 small bombs, for killing light ground targets
2. Interceptor - Equips the drone squadron with an anti-missile turrent
3. AA Missiles - Equips the drone squadron with 2 air to air missiles, can only be fired from behind

Air Support Bomber (ASB) - TotalUpgradeSlots=1
1. Cluster Bombs - equips the bomber with 6 volleys of wide area bombing ordinance
2. LGB - the bomber is equiped with 6 precision guided bombs (projectiles track their targets), dropped in pairs
3. Torpeedo - the bomber is equiped with 4 torpeedos, dropped in pairs.

Strike Fighter (SF) - TotalUpgradeSlots=1
1. AA Missiles - Equips the fighter with 18 air to air missiles, fired in 6 missile volleys from behind, for destroying strategic aircraft and gunships. No other weapons are carried.
2. Guided Missiles - Equips the fighter with 12 air to ground missiles, fired in 4 missile volleys. No other weapons are carried.

Air Superiority Fighter (ASF) - TotalUpgradeSlots=1
1. AA Missiles - Equips the ASF wing with 8 air to air missiles, fired in pairs and from behind.
2. Stealth - Makes the aircraft un-detectable by radar
3. Fuel Tanks - Gives the ASF additional fuel capacity and afterburners to give a temporary speed boost.

Strategic Bomber - TotalUpgradeSlots=1
[This unit would be the equivalent of a B52, and the supcom equivalent of a T4 bomber]
1. Bomb - Typical high yield ordinance
2. Nuke - Drops a single nucklear bomb (cannot be intercepted by anti-nuke systems)
3. Guided Missiles - 60 guided missiles, rapidly fired in 6 missile volleys with auto-target switching
4. Commando BOTs - Paradrops 4 squads of Commando BOTs at a target location
5. Mine - scatters land mines or naval mines over a target land or water region.

Escort Boat - TotalUpgradeSlots=1
1. SAM - Equips the flotilla with surface to air missiles
2. Interceptor - Equips the flotilla with missile interceptors
3. Mine Hunter - Equips the flotilla with anti-mine field generators preventing nearby naval mines from detonating.

Frigate (FF) - TotalUpgradeSlots=1
1. Sonar - provides extended sonar range for sub-hunting
2. FFG - provides the frigate with a guided missile for ship engagements
[FF basic weapons = deck gun + RPDC + ASW Drone pad]

Destroyer (DD) - TotalUpgradeSlots=1
1. AWD - "Air warfare destroyer" outfit, provides improved AA and anti missile capabilities
2. Heavy Cannon - provides additional direct firepower and armour for closer ship to ship engagement
[DD basic weapons = Heavy Cannon + RPDC + Interceptor + SAM]

Cruiser (CL) - TotalUpgradeSlots=1
1. CLG - provides the cruiser with an additional TML launcher for attacking key land targets
2. CA - "Attack Cruiser" equips the vessel with rocket torpeedos for killing other naval vessels at long range
[CL basic weapons = deck gun + Interceptor + SAM + Missiles]

Battleship (BB) - TotalUpgradeSlots=2
1. ASW Drone Pad - provides a squadron of anti submarine aircraft for self protection
2. AA - provides additional missile interceptors and SAM launchers
3. SMD - Anti-nuke defence missile
4. Shield - Provides elongated mediium area shield
5. BBG - provides several batteries of guided missiles for added bombardment capability

Attack Submarine (SS) - TotalUpgradeSlots=1
1. Decoy - equips the sub with a special torpeedo that can mimic a submarine sonar signature
2. Mine - equips the sub with 6 naval mines, it must return to a shipyard to reload

Guided Missile Submarine (SSG) - TotalUpgradeSlots=1
1. SAM - allows the sub to launch AA missiles from underwater
2. Javelin - increases the range of missiles

* note for submarines - subs have sonar stealth while stationary, and can only be spotted by ASW drones overhead. They can be spotted by sonar while moving, but the only vessels with sonar are frigates and destroyers. Sonar on ships however is mostly forward facing allowing the posibility of rear approach. Submarines can only release torpeedos from close range.



Anyway, that is about all I have. If there are any thoughts on what will work and what wont, please feel free to comment, thx

I do not think you know what that word means...

Sweet list though. I can tell alot of thought went into it.

rofl i was thinking the same thing

Yea sorry about that, I was thinking the same thing after I wrote it.
However, I simply boiled down my ideas into a unit list, and allowed you (the reader) to figure out the implied changes that this would cause to gameplay. After reading the following, you might realise I was infact being brief

Here is my reasoning for the above changes:

Basically, I was advocating that the game move in the direction of having fewer units, but achieving greater unit depth through the use of upgrades. Essentially, the upgrades should not simply be some minor addition, but should be a major change to the weapon platform that completely changes the units fuction. From a basic selection of 20 units (weapon platforms), it would be possible to construct 300 unique unit configurations. The basic rules for upgrading, prevent modifications to units in the field, but allow units to be recycled when they return to base. This would make the game more dynamic and induce greater strategic thinking, as players are required to carefully match weapon loadouts to match a rapidly changing battlefield. The upgrades should not be global as seen in SC2, but should be applied at the unit/battalion level.

I'd adcocate that submarine engagements be more focused on stealth and suprise, by making submarines more vunerable and yet more volatile at the same time. Submarine combat should truly be a hunter-killer combat, not the brute force attrition that we saw in SC/FA or SC2.

I'd advocate that land combat be made more dynamic by the use of 2 different defencive structure types. Static and Mobile defences. Allowing turrent lines and artillery lines to be moved in the field, as is done today in a modern military force. The use of static defences would be reserved for secure and permanent instalations. I believe that this would support the dynamic gameplay we saw in compeditive SC/FA, and even encourage this further.

I'd recommend that the tech-tree, base construction, engineering & resource collection be greatly simplified by reducing the number of units required to perform these tasks. The most radical change that I suggested was to entierly do away with the engineer. Instead of assigning construction tasks to engineers, the player should simply build in "god mode". They should only need to define what they want, and where they want it - without the need to mess around with individual engineers.

Mass upgrades should be completely automated. the longer a mex survives, the more mass it will produce untill maximum output is achived.

The suggested changes to the way power is handled were intended to better resemble an actual supply line. In SC/FA power sniping was often an uncertain tactic because if you opponent had pgens anywhere else, they had alternative supply. Late game power sniping often demanded a lot of collateral damage to ensure supply had been cut. With the suggested changes, surgical strikes can be made to halt major projects in isolated areas. Which reintroduce the eco-snipe as a valid "play-for-time" (stall) tactic. The other motivation for the sugessted power system is to act as a mechanisim to confine bases to smaller areas, we can thus do away with the horrid adjacency mechanic.

Another change I'd suggested was to emphasise the importance of Aircraft Carriers and Airfields as strategic targets. I'd suggest that aircraft not be capable of operating without them. Aircraft should have limited armament, and return to be re-armed. Having an airfield close to the action would therefore be a huge tactical advantage. I'd also like to see the carrier mechanics allow launch and retrieval while underway.

I'd also like to see the game move away from the "spam-fest" where armies consisted of homogenious formations of the highest tiered melee unit at your disposal. Which is why I suggested that there be some thought put into how smaller and larger units should interact. I think that the most capable force should combine smaller and larger units, and that they should complement each other. The larger units should not render the smaller ones obsolete.

Anyway, I think that Supcom died when they brought out Supcom2. I think that there was just too much compromise. GPG tried to make the game more generic and in my view have suceeded. Supcom2 is now indistinguishable from other RTS titles, and can no longer be called the best RTS game. I think I'll change to Men of War, it seems to have much greater potential.

But if the above changes were considered for a supcom sequel, I might consider buying it.

Excellent points Firewall. Excellent points.

Supcom-2 was a horrible game.

I don't want to sound arrogant and spiteful here but I think Supcom-2 was made for..

1. People who don't have powerful computers. That is why the maps are smaller, and you get to start off with just three units. Some people who are too cheap and dumb to buy an updated computer were feeling left out. Therefore, GPG and...that...man Square Enix tried to include the people who did not have powerful computers to enjoy the Supcom franchise. What happened is that the loyal fans were alienated with bad gameplay and an significant reduction of versitility and options.

2. Trying to apply the RTS game concept to console games being the XBOX-360 and PS-3. Look if they wanted to do thatthan they should have made a totally different game. Apparently Supcom-1 and Supcom-FA did not fare well in the console market if I'm not wrong. So what is the point of making Supcom-2 appeal to the console more than the PC?

3. Insulting the loyal fanbase of Supcom-1 and Supcom-FA by modifying the maps in Supcom-2. Tell me what fan was not insulted when they saw what they did with Fields of Isis, Finns Revenge and other original Supcom-1 and Supcom-FA maps? I played the Fields of Isis on Supcom-2 and I was insulted of the lack of challenge, lack of versitiltiy of stragety and the ridiculous ease because some people "oh can't handle the challenge of the original Supcom and Supcom FA". Too bad.

4. Finally, there was really no need to make a Supcom-2? The previous two Supcom games were perfect. All they needed to do was to make another expansion disc with more new maps and maybe an extra unit or so. To change the entire storyline, economic concept(BIGGEST mistake there), and the maps was a big mistakes.

Thus this lead to an alienation of the fans, hence Supcom franchise is in a state of flux as of now.


This can be corrected. Just make an expansion discs with new maps for Supcom-Forged Alliance. I bet you, if GPG does that that will revive Supcom franchise overnight. The new maps will bring new challenges to the loyal fanbase to play on.

I think that this would definately be a godo start, however. I think that GPG has been running into some comercial issues with their old buddies at THQ, who have stonewalled the project out of pure spite. Unofrtunately the FA title will recieve no help from THQ and thus GPG is powerless. The SC/FA title unfortunately has seen its last days.

The union of Square Enix (SE) and GPG has brought new life into the SupCom franchise, which is of course welcome. I am apreciative that GPG has revealed SC2, and I do feel that it was needed. But I think that the involvement of SE has brought fourth an unwelcome change in direction. That direction being toward the implementation of RTS on a mass market. But this is for naught, because RTS has allways been a fringe market, RTS is the "chess club" of the gaming community. By simplifying the game they have denied their routes, and by denyikng their routes they deny their key audience - That being gamers that can think strategically. Which is quite an irony when you stop to think about it.... of all people, you would expect the market analists at SE to understand the importance of 'strategy'.

I am unclear as to what the best direction for this game actually is. A simple release of maps - or any other change to FA for that matter is impossible because of THQ. So the future lies soely with SC2, but SC2 in my view has gone in the wrong direction, and focused on simplification, when they really should have been aiming for synergy and improvement. I also think that the people at GPG feel this way, but that the commercial interaction with SE has over-extended itself to strangle creative direction at GPG. I can also see that there is a lot of "creation-for-creativities-sake" in SC2. I realise that there is a need to strech boundaries, but there is "way cool" and then there is "plain silly". I think that some things in SC2 fall into the latter category.

In order to forge a way ahead with FA, I think that it shall be necessary to resort to mods and private matchmaking. Fortunately, FA is highly compatible with modding, given time a complete re-write of the game dynamics would be possible. But in truth I think the ultimate RTS is a long way from being realised, GPG showed us the light, they were so close, but they missed. Now it is time for others to carry on where they left off.

Whilst I may have a creative mind, I am not an experienced modder or programmer. I also do not have much time to devote to a project like this, so I guess I should quit while I'm ahead. I guess it is time for me to go and get a life

The small maps and aircraft movement style are the downfall of Sup/Com 2 . It would have been better if they made an expansion to F/A and incorporated the research tree .Instead of making a new game ! I think that the idea of having different weapon loadouts would be good . A bit like the Mechwarriour / Mechcommander chassis and weapon loadout . Over the four categories , light ,medium,heavy and assault there are different weapon layouts . Even in the same class because one heavy is different to another .

Yea, that was precisely what I was trying to aim at. A lot of my ideas on what upgrading should look like are inspired by Mechwarrior, and the soldier class specialisations in various FPS games. The idea being that you can't have everything, and upgrades are not applicable across all units. But the upgrade should make the unit function differently.

For example, take the idea of the battle mech, in SC/FA we have a few different moddels here. Mongoose, Titan, Percival & Sniper (and their factional equivalents). These units, had quite different roles, but all are battlemechs. So why not replace them with a single unit, and make each of the variants an 'specialisation' of the base model unit, made avaliable through an upgrade. This is how I thought that the upgrade system should have worked.

As can be seen from the detail of my original post, this concept can be expanded across all land, sea and air units. Thus we can have bombers converted to carry torpeedos, Fighters converted to carry bombs, boats converted to deploy and clear mines. etc. However, the bomber would not be able to drop torpeedos and bombs in the same mission. It would need to return to the carrier/airfield, re-equip with bombs and then proceed to the second target.

I'm really late to the party, but I just read your post. I love your ideas, especially the stuff about local power grids. I think it's weird how you can build power generators and mexes on one side of a map and have a working factory on the other. I'm not currently aware of any games that allow you to focus on supply chains and logistics for your armies.

The only change I'd propose is that mexes, mass fabs, etc, also have a radius similar to that of power generators (ie. engineers and factories that are close enough will automatically draw mass from these structures). If factories are too far away, however, they can still get their mass from special supply trucks. These would be mobile units that can draw mass, store it internally, and distribute it wherever it is needed. If you really want to, it can also have an internal battery to distribute energy as well.

I've been thinking a lot about this lately, and I've gone so far as to say that all combat units could require some amount of mass and energy to operate, similar to the way that air units have to be refueled. Energy would be needed for energy-based weaponry and fuel, mass would be needed if the unit fires bullets or missiles. You would still have air strips to refuel and repair air units, but it would also resupply their missiles, et al (in the form of mass), and you could also have refueling depots for land units and docks for sea units. But in addition to all of this, you could also accompany your armies with supply trucks to extend their effective range; the supply trucks could restore mass and energy, and could also contain a repair suite to repair damaged units. Either that or use engineers.

This is probably significantly overthinking it and making it much more complicated than necessary, but I feel like it would introduce novel strategic considerations to matches. Instead of destroying an opponent's units directly, you can take out the depots, air strips and supply trucks and let the army slowly starve itself to death. You could fly supply trucks in via transports to hot zones to support your armies, but they have to carefully be move and escorted or else your opponent will shoot them down. Yes, you could just rush your opponent and beat him over the head with blunt force, but you could also wage economic war on him and deny him critical shipments of fuel and ammo. It would also change the way mexes are handled; holding them isn't enough, you also have to be able to get that mass from point A to point B.

Just my $0.02.

indeed