I would like to express my support for Domino and Resin_Smoker. I think the mods they have created have been excellent, and obviously taken a great deal of work. It is my opinion they have been treated unfairly.

Hopefully I'm not locked out as well for giving my honest opinion, if so, then so be it!

Domino & Resin, if you do read this, I appreciate your work very much on this game, and hope that you will continue it on a different forum. If you do, please post where you go to.

I urge other members who have found these 2 members mods to be as useful as I have, to please post your support for them, that they may continue their work on this game on another forum.

Complete agreement with above.

Dominos' work is the one reason I continue to visit these forums - and I have to think that by removing him, a great void will appear in this community.

Unfortunately Mod Talk isn't the place to talk about this, so I'll be moving this to Forum Feedback.

Mike

Domino is super great. I would hate to see him go away. Moderators please find a way to appease Dom. It's worth the effort. The guy isn't super demanding.

OJ could you take the link out of your signature pictures for BO. It's really big and makes it hard to navigate with a touch pad.

Sorry if either of these requests are a pain. I do think you guys do work hard to understand the difference between the letter and the spirit of the rules.

If you guys need help with anything, it never hurts to ask. A slow inquiry response is better than shooting from the hip.

Thanks

Bast

We did, unfortunately he decided to oppose the moderators repeatedly and needlessly escalated the situation.

Not to mention the Moderators didn't have anything to dowith Valk's actions.

Mike

What Valk did was probably the right thing to do. She should probably indicate that the thread can be unlocked yadda yadda upon reaching some kind of mutual understanding and discussion if she has time. I know it's not policy to go out of the way with every miscreant on these boards to have a personal discussion with the problematic party, but Dom is a pretty special case.

Also it's a good idea to post in the rules thread exactly where you want the rules to be discussed. It may not solve all your issues, but it certainly might help. I would think the mod forum an appropriate place to discuss mod forum rules topic, but ultimately that's up to GPG.

-Bast

Went through he last two pages of the thread. Couldn't keep track with some of it because of the private videos. But the last post on 24 and then pretty much the whole of page 25 was pretty much completely off of the original topic, thus warranting a lock.
After the week is up, if he wishes to do so, let him open another thread for his mod, compile all the details about it and let it be discussed again. If he doesn't wish to do so, then so be it.
All his implied swearing and such on the last post of 24 and in page 25 had no point and just made him look a bit childish IMO.

I come here as a neutral party. I knew nothing of Domino the circumstances and such.
I am not a fan of his mod so I won't take his side.
I know the moderators can be a little overbearing in the enforcement of the rules from time to time so I won't take their side right away.
However. If he was posting copyrighted material I fully support the deletion of those posts (and so should everyone) and I fully support the ban.

What exactly did they do (since some posts were deleted, for some reason)?

Yeah, I missed all the drama. WTF is this all about?

Quick rundown:

OK asked me if people using copyrighted material from SC2 without permission from SE (which is illegal) should be "banned" and I pointed out that if it is illegal it doesn't belong here. He asks a modder who is using parts of SC2 models to not use said model and the modder agrees.

OK edits his mod talk rules post to make it clear that he feels that cross game modding at least somewhat violates the rights of each of the game's owners and that it shouldn't be posted here.

Domino decides it's a good idea to discus rules in random mod threads and he is asked politely in PM to not to it again, that his opinions have been noted and will be considered and that his posts were moved to the moderator forum in the hopes that the thread(s) would get back on topic.

At first he seemed to accept this but then he'd start making off topic posts again and complain when they were moved by a mod for the same reasons he'd already been given. In response he did his "I'm leaving the forum because the mods are dictators" rant. I do understand his frustration but we are equally frustrated by his unwillingness to understand our point of view. I supported OK's decisions on the matter and for me it was settled after those earlier PM's.

Eventually Domino more or less demanded to speak to a superior so I passed it on to my supervisor, Valkyria. After reading the posts in the moderator forum and the posts in Domino's own mod thread he came to the conclusion that we behaved appropriately and it seemed like Domino was unwilling to accept any other conclusion other than us being blamed.

Valk then decided to lock the thread as it had gone way off topic and such a discussion does not belong in Moho Mod Talk in the first place (which is what we've been trying to get Domino to understand the whole time.)

As for Resin's allegations of his posts being edited or deleted I can only say that there are no references to this in the moderator logs and I went back till August to make sure I didn't miss anything. So his allegations proved to be false too.

Resin decided it would be a great idea to post in unrelated threads how the mods are Nazis so these posts were deleted promptly after which both Resin's and Domino's accounts were deactivated for a week by Valk.

No moderator can change this because one needs admin access to activate/deactivate accounts.

Again, I do understand Domino's frustration but there is only so many times we can tell somebody to please post in the relevant section and not in random threads and take them off topic before we simply take action. He speaks about respect and demands I show it for him when he clearly doesn't respect me. Instead he makes unfounded allegations and accused me and OK of deleting posts simply to get the last word. I am sorry but calling people dictators for trying to do what they're supposed to do is not respectful at all. Not the mention the unneeded swearing in his posts.

That's about it. Valk said he will reactivate the accounts next week and of course Domino is free to create a new thread for his mod. In fact I see no reason why the original thread can't be unlocked after the off topic posts are removed but that won't be my decision. Whatever happens next I refuse to have any part in it lest I be accused of something I didn't do once again.

The worst thing about this is people blaming me and OK for Valk's decision when it was clearly Domino who asked more than once to speak to somebody above us and in a way brought the decision on himself considering the matter was settled for me quite a while ago if he had just stopped making off topic posts and continued the discussion in the proper sub-forum (this one in case you are wondering.)

Everything LD said.

I just want to add aswell that I was getting fed up and was about to move everything into it's own thread and show Domino where he should be talking about this kind of stuff, unfortunately I had a 3AM shift that day and Valk took action before I got home, Iphones aren't the best for Moderating, quick posts and reading them yes. xD

So as I said before, we did try to reason with Domino, but when you send a PM about where he can discuss the topics properly and the reply starts with "Your an idiot" you kinda get annoyed.

Mike

It's pretty obvious what happened here...

The moderator(s) started altering, deleting or moving threads, just like was done with this thread. When Domino later challenged the moderator’s actions the he was "silenced" by moderators selectively deleting Domino's posts. This isn't the first time this has happened as there's at least 5-6 instances within Forum Feedback alone that highlight the repeated abuse from the same group of moderators.

Furthermore it's well known that being modders themselves, the moderators are biased thus creating a direct conflict of interest and a hostile forum environment for anyone not in their little circle of friends. Over the years, they've quietly and repeatedly undermined the efforts of the other mod groups, often leading to such mod groups walking away from SC / FA / SC2 modding rather then tolerating such harassment. The overall effects is that the GPG "Community" ends up being a "click" of select individuals with their own personal agendas.

Valkyria for her part, rather than deal with what caused the situation opted to once again, turn a blind eye to the actions of her moderators and ban the two modders who both had legitimate grievances:



With respect to Valkyria's post..... she's right we don’t own this forum but we do supply the 3rd party content that players seek here. Without our content and posts, GPG forums wouldn't exist.

With this in mind, effective immediately:

1) All links to 4DC and DMS pic's, video and downloads will be locked after today.

2) Future copies of 4DC and DMS will have their scripts scrambled to prevent reverse engineering. Gone are the days of sharing 4DC / DMS scripts within GPGnet.

3) Time locks will be embeded into 4DC / DMS scripts, deactivating the mods past a preset date. This will thus ensure that all 4DC and DMS content will only come from sites of "our" choosing.

4) Future releases (if any) will come from ModDB.

In closing I can say that it's been great fun working on 4DC over the years and though I've only been working with Domino a short while he's one of the best modders I've met!

As for our beloved moderators, I dare say I can speak for Domino on this as well... We could go all day bashing you but they already know what we think of you. Domino and I just hope you all get what your after, whatever your personal agendas maybe.

To Orange Knight: Seams kind of laughable that i do recall the day that you begged me to nominate you as a forum scout. if only I'd known he'd turn out to be such an arse. Oh, well “hind sight” (excuse the pun) as they say is 20/20.

To Valkyria: I fully expect this thread to be locked or deleted but if you dare....

Leave it up and unlocked to see just what the community really thinks of all this for once, you might be surprised at what you learn from folks that don’t have their posts deleted.

Oh and BTW... Labeling me and Domino as "Trolls", for posting within our threads, really? I could easily creatively label you with a few well known four letter phases to actively describe your poor management of this situation but I wont.... Think about that for a moment.

Respectfully,

Resin_Smoker
4DC Lead Modder
DMS Contributer

Hi there,

I realy hope GPG will hear ... but I think GPG is on the forum, only when they are anything to sell ...

So .... in all other game there are some tolerance with the " cross game modding " and only the editors can take sanction or call the modder if there is any problem with a copyright.

If you see others game like C&C generals, Empire At Wars and a lot of others there are a tons of mods like Stargate, Starwars, Halo ( and a lot of others ) and the editors said nothings ...

But on gpg forum some persons decide " oh no we do not want this " ....

If we follow this
- 1 we can't have a starwars mod because starwars is copyrighted ...
- 2 we can't have a TA mod because TA is copyrighted
- 3 we can't have any mod who use the modelhack because the original unit who used is copyrithed ....
( I think we can find a lot of thing who are copyrithed ... )

GPG has always prefer entrusts the forum control at the community and now we can see this not work ...

When I read this :



I think there is a BIG problem with the moderation rules ...

SupCom2 stuff is copyrighted, it's annoying, but I can see why the mods don't want it on the official forum. Then again, I usually decide not to notice these things. Lots of posts, can't read them all, can I?

My advice to everybody included in this:
Take a deep breath, let things rest for a couple of days, forget your anger and start over.

asdrubaelvect, Valk is actually correct, (I never thought I would say that...) - except for his/her? atrocious spelling of privilege. Not entirely sure how you can take off a right either but that's beside the point I guess.

And you all suck at trolling! Damn amateurs...

Wait what? So we would have to redownload it every so often? That doesnt make sense...

Feel free to continue your unfounded allegations and slander but spamming random, unrelated threads with a link to this one does warrant the deletion of those posts and proves how this is just a vendetta against us as you have continuously refused any sort of dialogue that goes beyond calling us Nazis.

You accuse us of undermining other mod groups and chasing them away. I would say the burden of proof is on you. Perhaps you mean Normalius who you threatened to kill for using your mod or parts thereof in his? Technically you should have been banned threatening him. You've gotten away with a lot of (borderline) offensive and disrespectful posts so don't talk to me about us being disrespectful and abusing you.

Seems to me like quite a few people agree with us and think you are overreacting from which I can only draw one conclusion. I don't even know why I'm still bothering. You've made up your mind, so be it.

I wish you all the best with your endeavors at ModDB.

I hope Resin comes back to see this.
You're still a whiny little bit­ch. Talented modder, yes. But you're a whiny little bit­ch nonetheless.

Why does it matter about shooting down "rival" modders? You all love the SupCom series so I'd put money on it that, like with Manimal when he tried to advertise his mod in SupComGenDiss but it got moved to mod talk then locked for being a useless thread, you're blowing stuff out of proportion with feelings of paranoia and jealousy and crying abuse of power. Grow up Resin and Domino and whatever other prat wants to start crying and stir up drama.

I'd have merely stayed leaning towards support of LD, OK and Valk on this but such actions of anal pain and childishness do wonders.

R.E. Valk, they settled the matter by shutting that bit­chfest down by terminating the trouble makers, unsuccessfully though.


P.S. Did that bit­ch Resin send that PM to every member of these forums?

P.P.S. Resin and Domino aren't trolls. That's an insult to trolls.

@Brandon: Resin and Domino seem to be the only Nazis here, eh?


That.

I would also encourage both sides to cool down and re-think positions as well...hopefully coming up with some compromise. In the end, does anyone really want to fracture the modding community this badly?

Everyone suffers here...no one really gains anything...

Your a Nazi, Gtfo.
K thanks.

HTK, I saw some examples of Domino's work, going round and derailing threads with copyright related posts. He is in the wrong here.
It would be like if the allies sat down with Hitler and said "Stop warring on everyone and we'll let you kill all of the Jews."

If Domino was using SupCom2 models in his mods for FA and it is illegal, I'd inform SE. If they take matters further, I'd get a laugh. If not, oh well.
Oh well, I know little on that subject and have no proof for SE.


@Brandon: How so? How am I Nazi for hating on Domino and resin for being a pair of tw­ats? If anything I should report your post as offensive and request you be banned. Stir up a bit of drama, but that's not my job. That's Resin's and Domino's


It's safe to say that this thread has run its course and thus will be locked.
I miss those days when we'd see the occasional thread locked with something along the lines of that back in OT.
@Valk: Let Funky lock this thread for the sake of memories of more active times back in OT. Give him rights even if for only a few minutes

Leave them alone will ya? They done alot to FA, brought alot of great stuff, and yet you people treat them like ****, even after they are gone. SHAME ON YOU!

Shame on them for being a pair of tw­ats. Doesn't matter what great stuff they did, what matters is their behaviour now. Stop sucking their epeens and look at this from a real perspective. One that isn't filled with their pubic hairs.


I tell you now I will keep this up just for the sake of getting this train wreck locked/deleted even if it results in me being banned :\
I'll toss Valk a PM.

Mind you, that's what Resin wanted, right? This thread to be locked to show what Nazi's GPG Admin and Moderators are? Well I'm giving them another reason. Someone was being a twat

They MIGHT of gone a lil bit overboard, but I dont see them as being wrong. But the way you people act, are like a bunch of dunghead hounds. Getting your kicks off of other peoples misery.

They are gone, Leave it be.

I never said they were wrong to raise objections to OK's original decision. They were wrong to do it in the way and the place they did.

But Bradon, if you continue calling people Nazis you will also be banned. For now I will merely edit your post. As for leaving it be... As you can see for yourself it is them (and you) who aren't letting it be. For me this was over after I sent the last PM to Domino weeks ago considering he claimed to understand where I was coming from and assured me everything was okay now only to post his rant sometime later.

As for both sides having to cool down, I have kept my cool the entire time. Read the posts, find the two people that are tossing around insults and tell them to cool down. We attempted compromise, the result is more drama.

As for now there is no reason to lock this thread. Not yet but if this discussion takes a turn for the worst with more name calling I see no other option but it won't be me making that call lest I be called a Nazi again.

Sending out a mass PM to I don't even know how many people and spamming threads makes him no different from the hundreds of bots I ban every month.

What could explain the sudden change of behaviour of LD and OK toward us moders ?

Does GPG want to abandon everything that's SupCom and FA related ?

This could be a somewhat twisted way to force us to give up with moding anyway.

<EDIT>
if this is about model hacking, then Orange Knight should self-censor his own work as he has hacked some models in the past... (hypocrite !)

Also, what's true for 3D material, is true as well for scripts.
So if we would apply strictly LD's + OK's "rules" then it would be TOTALLY ILLEGAL to mod any of GPG's games !

However, products owned by THQ and Square Enix are none of LD's + OK's business.

Given none of both companies explicitly complained about model hacking in the mods found @ GPG, then LD + OK should just leave us alone !

End of the story.
</EDIT>